Are we car enthusiasts being weeded out?

[HULK_I6T]

With the commodore and falcon being retired, i cant but think that car enthusiasts are also being thrown out with the bath water.

The younger generation seem to have a diminishing interest in cars with many of their car choices not really supported in the aftermarket modifications. The younger seem more content with styling over substance, cars being throw away items when they are not cool in their social circles or in the carpark at work.

Then there is us... we recognised falcon and commodore for many years for their substance and unique style, not afraid to be labelled hoons or bogans. But with no falcon or commodore many of us will likely grow up and mature our tastes into something more credible on a social level (amongst non car enthusiasts). Still fast cars but likely to leave them in factory spec due to lack of aftermarket support, or excessive cost to custom modify.

So do we just down tools and move on? Im pretty disappointed about the state of affairs but it seems inevitable, find a new hobby? Just evaluate cars on their specification /performance off the factory floor.

where do you see car enthusiasts in 10 years?? Live on or will we be weeded out?

[Express]

Car enthusiasts are not just confined to Ford and Holden or modifications.

End of story.



.

[HULK_I6T]

Originally Posted by Express

Car enthusiasts are not just confined to Ford and Holden or modifications.

End of story.



.

In this country the aftermarket by far supports falcon and commodore over anything else, maybe wrx is a distant 3rd and then there is clear daylight to anything else.

Where are the car enthusiasts going to go? (Overwelming majority support falcon and commodore)

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by Express

Car enthusiasts are not just confined to Ford and Holden or modifications.

End of story.



.

That's the first thing I thought..."assuming car enthusiasts only drive Commodores of Falcons...ha".

I don't have a Commodore of Falcon...I have an old Kingswood ute, and they haven't been made for nearly thirty years, yet I have no problem buying literally anything you could name for it, standard, modified, aftermarket, hell, even from dealerships sometimes for certain bits.
Same with our other "enthusiast car"...it's not a Commodore or Falcon either, it's an '82 Celica, and again, I can get nearly everything for it aftermarket, or, surprisingly, from Toyota themselves for even obscure bits and pieces.

There was much wailing and nashing of teeth when the Kingswood name disappeared, I can assure you...probably just as much if not more than we are seeing now regarding the Commodore/Falcon. But the world didn't end, people started driving different cars and wondered what all the fuss had been about...and they promptly started working out how to modify those cars as soon as they were out of warranty.

It'll happen again, sure as night follows day.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

There was much wailing and nashing of teeth when the Kingswood name disappeared, I can assure you...probably just as much if not more than we are seeing now regarding the Commodore/Falcon. But the world didn't end, people started driving different cars and wondered what all the fuss had been about...and they promptly started working out how to modify those cars as soon as they were out of warranty.

It'll happen again, sure as night follows day.

That doesn't wash with me, it's a completely different story now. When the Commodore replaced the Kingswood it was essentially a new but slightly smaller locally made 6/8 cyl rwd sedan replacing an older locally made 6/8 cylinder rwd sedan.
Now we have the factory closing completely and our replacement is a Chinese made 4 cylinder fwd sedan. The difference here is like night and day and your comparison is a long bow to draw.

[MAD]

Originally Posted by stevz

That doesn't wash with me, it's a completely different story now. When the Commodore replaced the Kingswood it was essentially a new but slightly smaller locally made 6/8 cyl rwd sedan replacing an older locally made 6/8 cylinder rwd sedan.
Now we have the factory closing completely and our replacement is a Chinese made 4 cylinder fwd sedan. The difference here is like night and day and your comparison is a long bow to draw.

From a consumer's view there is no difference. A name, and an icon, both disappeared.

Cruze is built here (for now), and in Korea. Not China.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by MAD

From a consumer's view there is no difference. A name, and an icon, both disappeared.

Cruze is built here (for now), and in Korea. Not China.

I was referring to the supposed Commodore replacement, not the Cruze.

http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11410151

[UberKnee]

Car Enthusiast does not equal Falcon/Commodore driver. Sure if all you want is a cheap, basic car with a big motor thats great in a straight line they're good. But for outright overall performance the Evo X and WRX makes mincemeat of them especially on a track. Drag racing is a different story of course. Then you've got Supra's, BRZ's, Skylines, etc.

Hell even alot of the hot hatchbacks are great performance cars. Aussie enthusiasts need to realise that Holden/Ford aren't the be all and end all of performance. You can get V10 M5's for $60,000 thesedays, AMG V12 powered cars for similar. An 06 Audi RS5 is about the same price too.

Holden and Ford did well enough, kitting out their Taxi's with powerful motors but they were never the be all and end all of performance.

And I think you'll find that with the demise of Falcadore more performance workshops geared towards Euro and Jap cars will spring up. Anyone pretending that their isn't a huge aftermarket for BMWs, Mercs, Jags, Subaru, Toyota, etc. are fooling themselves, its just that in Australia Ford/Holden have held most of the attention.

[TC200six]

You don't need to be into modifying to be an enthusiast.

[Express]

Originally Posted by UberKnee

Car Enthusiast does not equal Falcon/Commodore driver.

Anyone pretending that their isn't a huge aftermarket for BMWs, Mercs, Jags, Subaru, Toyota, etc. are fooling themselves, its just that in Australia Ford/Holden have held most of the attention.

F6_benito needs to get out more.


.

[HULK_I6T]

Agreed that enthusiasts exist anywhere but in this country the overwelming majority are falcodore enthusiasts. Decades of models to confirm this support. Decades of selling at number 1 on the sales charts. A proud history and heritage to support. The au model showed that drastic change would not be well received. (Despite how good the au is)

to go cold turkey on them? They dont just pick another model and carry on.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by f6_benito

Agreed that enthusiasts exist anywhere but in this country the overwelming majority are falcodore enthusiasts. Decades of models to confirm this support. Decades of selling at number 1 on the sales charts. A proud history and heritage to support. The au model showed that drastic change would not be well received. (Despite how good the au is)

to go cold turkey on them? They dont just pick another model and carry on.

Well said. The majority of us have never known a world without Falcon or Commodore in it. Our pride and heritage is being throw away and we are just expected to lap up the garbage that they are going to shove down our throats to replace it?
The ironic thing is that people keep harping on that the car makers are responding to markets by giving people cars they want to buy, when in reality they are taking away what is the only choice for many of us and giving us cars we don't want.

[UberKnee]

Originally Posted by stevz

Well said. The majority of us have never known a world without Falcon or Commodore in it. Our pride and heritage is being throw away and we are just expected to lap up the garbage that they are going to shove down our throats to replace it?
The ironic thing is that people keep harping on that the car makers are responding to markets by giving people cars they want to buy, when in reality they are taking away what is the only choice for many of us and giving us cars we don't want.

Heres the thing though, Falcon/Commodore sold in very small numbers and lsot money on every car sold, so obviously not that many 'enthusiasts' were buying new. Therefor not many enthusiasts will actually be affected. Only a fool keeps trying to sell what cant be sold. The Jap car scene, Muscle car scene, offroad scene, minitruck scene in Australia are huge and none of them rely on Falcodore. You dont have to drive a Falcadore to be an enthusiast.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by UberKnee

Heres the thing though, Falcon/Commodore sold in very small numbers and lsot money on every car sold, so obviously not that many 'enthusiasts' were buying new. Therefor not many enthusiasts will actually be affected. Only a fool keeps trying to sell what cant be sold. The Jap car scene, Muscle car scene, offroad scene, minitruck scene in Australia are huge and none of them rely on Falcodore. You dont have to drive a Falcadore to be an enthusiast.

This is only true for the last couple of years. Prior to this Falcadore enthusiasts made up the overwhelming majority and you are making a mistake by underestimating this.
I have zero interest in Jap or other car scenes. I cannot change what is in my blood.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by Danny

Which variant was the perfect all rounder mate? Be more specific, because anything lower than a G6ET/XR6T or an SS ISN'T even a performance cars a$sho!e. Last time I checked, "enthusiasts" DO NOT drive the Base model falcons or C'dores. The XT falcon and Exec/Evoke commodores are sluggish, boring, plastic (not just confined to the base model) transport driven by people who don't care, or of whom had the cars forced upon them as a company car..

I can understand the dubious labelling of the highest FPV's and HSV's as "performance" (no matter how loosely they fit the mould), and I agree that they do have a following of enthusiasts. But don't try to tell me that anything less than the Turbo and V8 variants appeal to performance enthusiasts BECAUSE THEY DON'T.

Couldnt agree more.

Dont feed the troll mate thats all he is. Manages to bring the same old opinion into every thread posted on here.

Broken record springs to mind.

As for being weeded out i highly doubt that is being happening because aussie cars are going.

[Bill M]

Wow! this thread has turned to crap fast!

I was under the impression Ford forums had a place for ALL car enthusiasts.
Obviously there is a fair degree of snobbery here

I have a preference for Aussie built as some of you may have picked up but after driving a Focus ST170 at a Ford drive day 10 years ago (That went quick!)
I was smitten with the "on rails" handling. Still ****ed that Ford AUS dropped the Focus build plan here and so was the Govt of the day.

The euro exotica AMG and BMW M series are fantastic vehicles but are not affordable new and in used form can be a spiraling money pit due to complicated drive lines and electronics.

As for bang for the buck the large Aussie rear drive is hard to beat, I can service it myself and parts are available relatively cheap and I like large cars as I find the driver's space comfortable.
The writing was on the wall when the Turbo fours came in and I believe this is reflected worldwide

The real challenge for the car interest fraternity is legislation not the cessation of large rear drive car production in Australia.

[fte50]

Originally Posted by DJM83

Couldnt agree more.

Dont feed the troll mate thats all he is. Manages to bring the same old opinion into every thread posted on here.

Broken record springs to mind.

As for being weeded out i highly doubt that is being happening because aussie cars are going.

Pathetic

[UberKnee]

And cant forget the Mustang, that comes with what is possibly the biggest aftermarket of any car in the world.

And there's nothing wrong with just stancing and wrapping a car, making it look good instead of chasing power you cant use. While its impressive to have 1000hp, unless you regularly race whats the point? Making a daily look like a nice car is probably money spent smarter.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by f6_benito

With the commodore and falcon being retired, i cant but think that car enthusiasts are also being thrown out with the bath water.

The younger generation seem to have a diminishing interest in cars with many of their car choices not really supported in the aftermarket modifications. The younger seem more content with styling over substance, cars being throw away items when they are not cool in their social circles or in the carpark at work.

Then there is us... we recognised falcon and commodore for many years for their substance and unique style, not afraid to be labelled hoons or bogans. But with no falcon or commodore many of us will likely grow up and mature our tastes into something more credible on a social level (amongst non car enthusiasts). Still fast cars but likely to leave them in factory spec due to lack of aftermarket support, or excessive cost to custom modify.

So do we just down tools and move on? Im pretty disappointed about the state of affairs but it seems inevitable, find a new hobby? Just evaluate cars on their specification /performance off the factory floor.

where do you see car enthusiasts in 10 years?? Live on or will we be weeded out?

I hear you. I can't see how any straight Australian male can look at the direction motoring is headed in this country and be happy about it.

Once locally made Holdens and Fords are gone, my passion for cars will die.
The closest replacement for our rwd sedans would be a high end Euro, but at 3 times the price combined with all the associated ownership costs put that out of the question.

The loss of our great cars to me is like somebody sticking a knife into my heart and twisting it around. With nothing on the horizon except a sea of generic, soulless rubbish, our car culture will slowly die and the only car enthusiasts remaining will be ones of older cars.

Sad times ahead.

[Express]

Originally Posted by stevz

Once locally made Holdens and Fords are gone, my passion for cars will die.

It won’t have any effect on enthusiasts who are only into old school.


Plus there are many Forums catering for car enthusiasts outside of just new model Ford and Holdens


.

[HULK_I6T]

Originally Posted by Express

It won’t have any effect on enthusiasts who are only into old school.



.

true but old school enthusiasts will get old too. With no new supporters will slowly be extinct. How many people get excited about the old valiants from the 60s and 70s?

any species who dont reproduce will become extinct.

One day someone with a genuine xy gtho phase 3 will be spruking that they have a original gtho and noone will bat an eyelid, noone will know what hes on about nor will they listen, they will tell him to shush up and sit still.

[LeadFoot81]

Originally Posted by f6_benito

any species who dont reproduce will become extinct.

Any species that doesn't evolve becomes extinct. There will always be car enthusiasts...existing ones will stay with what they consider classics or come to understand/respect/love the new types of performance cars being released. The next wave will have plenty of hero models to lust over; they'll just be different to what we have now. And someone, somewhere, will tinker with a car, irrespective of whether it's an 8, 6, 4, or electric.

[Express]

Originally Posted by f6_benito

true but old school enthusiasts will get old too. With no new supporters will slowly be extinct. How many people get excited about the old valiants from the 60s and 70s?

any species who dont reproduce will become extinct.

One day someone with a genuine xy gtho phase 3 will be spruking that they have a original gtho and noone will bat an eyelid, noone will kniw what hes on about nor will they listen, they will tell him to shush up.

Stupid me, I was drawn into something not worth commenting on in the first place.

You win, I’ll leave you to it.



.

[HULK_I6T]

Originally Posted by Express

Stupid me, I was drawn into something not worth commenting on in the first place.

You win, I’ll leave you to it.



.

Im not about winning anything, i think us car enthusiasts many cut from the same cloth will be defunct. Thats the sad part.

have your say, there is no winning or losing.

[stevz]

Originally Posted by f6_benito

true but old school enthusiasts will get old too. With no new supporters will slowly be extinct. How many people get excited about the old valiants from the 60s and 70s?

any species who dont reproduce will become extinct.

One day someone with a genuine xy gtho phase 3 will be spruking that they have a original gtho and noone will bat an eyelid, noone will kniw what hes on about nor will they listen, they will tell him to shush up.

They will be too busy doing up Hyundais and Kias to even care

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by stevz

They will be too busy doing up Hyundais and Kias to even care

So those people aren't car enthusiasts ???

As far as the topic goes, went to a small Friday catch up with a few enthusiasts last night. Unfortunately only 3500 could fit int the car park and the other 1000 odd had to be turned away. Along with about 10,000 odd people just to sticky, I would say the scene will survive with no probs!!!!!!

[Bill M]

Originally Posted by f6_benito

true but old school enthusiasts will get old too. With no new supporters will slowly be extinct. How many people get excited about the old valiants from the 60s and 70s?

any species who dont reproduce will become extinct.

One day someone with a genuine xy gtho phase 3 will be spruking that they have a original gtho and noone will bat an eyelid, noone will know what hes on about nor will they listen, they will tell him to shush up and sit still.

Younger generations generally are interested by cars of their time,
pre license dreamtime!
Go to an MG car club meet and see how many grey heads there are.

[jimt3te50]

Originally Posted by f6_benito

true but old school enthusiasts will get old too. With no new supporters will slowly be extinct. How many people get excited about the old valiants from the 60s and 70s?

any species who dont reproduce will become extinct.

One day someone with a genuine xy gtho phase 3 will be spruking that they have a original gtho and noone will bat an eyelid, noone will know what hes on about nor will they listen, they will tell him to shush up and sit still.

I don't think that's right- I bought an XY GT about 6 months ago. I'm 34 and have a wife and 2 kids- a boy 8 and a daughter 3. I've also got a new FG GT.

When we got the XY my young bloke asked what the things on the doors were for- they were the window winders.

If we go out on the weekend he wants to take the XY. Not a gadget in the thing, not even an air conditioner. And he doesn't care. There's just something he gets about the car and he doesn't need to be told what it is, it's different for everybody.

That boy will be an enthusiast. Trust me brother, we enthusiasts aren't going anywhere.

[UberKnee]

Originally Posted by stevz

I hear you. I can't see how any straight Australian male can look at the direction motoring is headed in this country and be happy about it.

Once locally made Holdens and Fords are gone, my passion for cars will die.
The closest replacement for our rwd sedans would be a high end Euro, but at 3 times the price combined with all the associated ownership costs put that out of the question.

The loss of our great cars to me is like somebody sticking a knife into my heart and twisting it around. With nothing on the horizon except a sea of generic, soulless rubbish, our car culture will slowly die and the only car enthusiasts remaining will be ones of older cars.

Sad times ahead.

Funny I was in an Evo X the other day, generic, soulless rubbish was the last thing that came to mind. If you're a true car enthusiast and not just a one brand, one model fan a car like that ticks practically every box.

Ford are bringing the Stang, GM will bring in something, More people will buy WRX and Evo, etc. E92 BMW V8s are getting cheaper, modern AMGs are getting very attainable second hand. Workshops will spring up to cater for these cars in the aftermarket. If anything the car enthusiast scene may get more interesting. Gets boring going to a car show and just seeing 95% Falcodores.

[BadMax]

Originally Posted by stevz

I hear you. I can't see how any straight Australian male can look at the direction motoring is headed in this country and be happy about it.

What's the issue or are you trying to project your one eyed insecurity as a threat to us?

Originally Posted by stevz

Once locally made Holdens and Fords are gone, my passion for cars will die.
The closest replacement for our rwd sedans would be a high end Euro, but at 3 times the price combined with all the associated ownership costs put that out of the question.

Yeah, because a well refined, well sorted and extremely high powered Euro is rubbish in comparison. Or are you one of those who call it rubbish as it doesn't fit into your budget?

Originally Posted by stevz

The loss of our great cars to me is like somebody sticking a knife into my heart and twisting it around. With nothing on the horizon except a sea of generic, soulless rubbish, our car culture will slowly die and the only car enthusiasts remaining will be ones of older cars.

Sad times ahead.

I guess the old blokes around here said the same 30 years ago. Times change champ, best you either move with them or just keep at being miserable.