Holden announces small car in two years!!!!

[Gobes32]

Its official, just heard on Channel 7 news in Melbourne, will be based on delta platform and be produced in two years. Kevin Rudd was in Adelaide today to announce green car funding.


Australian manufacturing now feels a little more secure. Be interesting to see if Ford announce anything to do with Focus, maybe some pics?

[Gobes32]

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sto...72-662,00.html

Hopefully the link works.......

[Paxton]

Yup.

It was only a matter of time before Holden did this. They are bleeding funds on VE (especially exports), and are about to cut their third shift, this can only help to bolster the output at Elizabeth. The only problem is, they're going to beat Ford to the punch, and their Marketing machine won't let the Australians forget it.

The million dollar question is, will Toyota now follow? I think they will.

On the flip side, Holden will only have a Hatch and a Sedan. We are getting Focus Hatch, Sedan, Wagon, and Kuga. Holden doesn't have an answer to Kuga, not even with their European connections.

Lastly, what does this mean to Astra, and why wouldn't Holden want to build their Euro car here, like Ford?

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Paxton

Yup.

It was only a matter of time before Holden did this. They are bleeding funds on VE (especially exports), and are about to cut their third shift, this can only help to bolster the output at Elizabeth.

You mean second shift, 3rd shift was cut back in the VY days.

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by vztrt

You mean second shift, 3rd shift was cut back in the VY days.

: Yeah, that...

Shows how far my knowledge of Holden runs.

[XR6_190]

Originally Posted by Paxton

On the flip side, Holden will only have a Hatch and a Sedan. We are getting Focus Hatch, Sedan, Wagon, and Kuga. Holden doesn't have an answer to Kuga, not even with their European connections.

Lastly, what does this mean to Astra, and why wouldn't Holden want to build their Euro car here, like Ford?

Form what I've read on Carpoint, This will replace both Astra and Viva/Lacetti, the same car would be sold in Europe as the Vauxhall/ Opel Astra, and in Asia as the Daewoo Lacetti, so here probably as the Holden Whatever.

Curious about the Focus Wagon you mentioned, since they've never sold the previous Focus Wagon here do we know if they will be building the new wagon here?

[JG66ME]

Originally Posted by Paxton

Yup.

Lastly, what does this mean to Astra, and why wouldn't Holden want to build their Euro car here, like Ford?

Exactly. The new Vectra is a nice car, Had one as a rental in May this year (Vauxhall). Better than that Korean we get here.

[Bossxr8]

One thing that concerns me about Ford and Holden making small cars is the potential loss of sales for the large cars in Falcon and Commodore.

They are cars in different classes but surely they will end up taking even more sales from the large cars that are already struggling? Government fleets may move from the large cars to the smaller more environmentally ones, and some diehard Ford or Holden buyers may still want to buy Australian but they might want to downside. Surely that will happen, and if large cars sink even more that that possibly result in the death of them?

Its a question that needs to be asked. If Falcon sales sink any lower then it will never justify the expense needed to upgrade it, sales are that low at the moment, if it goes any lower it surely can't survive?

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

One thing that concerns me about Ford and Holden making small cars is the potential loss of sales for the large cars in Falcon and Commodore.

They are cars in different classes but surely they will end up taking even more sales from the large cars that are already struggling? Government fleets may move from the large cars to the smaller more environmentally ones, and some diehard Ford or Holden buyers may still want to buy Australian but they might want to downside. Surely that will happen, and if large cars sink even more that that possibly result in the death of them?

Its a question that needs to be asked. If Falcon sales sink any lower then it will never justify the expense needed to upgrade it, sales are that low at the moment, if it goes any lower it surely can't survive?

I can't for the life of me understand why Ford don't maximise the Falcons potential, irrespective of wether they make a small car.

Fit current technology LPG system to it. Fix the issues with the car. Yes I know its a darn sight better car then BF, but there are still shortcuts and engineering compromises that can be improved on. Raise build quality if at all possible. I won't say fix dealer network, as Ford will fail in Australia, before they will do that apparently. Start replacing it is probably more appropriate.

So..

Launch new marketing campaign with a slogan like:

No Compromises
Performance of a six and fuel economy of a four.

Follow up main ads with examples of where a Falcon will be a much nicer place to live and play, then a Corrolla etc.

Hammer it at every advertising outlet, until all our ears bleed.

Change the fundamental thinking of Falcon from a fuel hungry car (common misconception) to a fuel saving car.

McDonalds convinced people its a healthy place to eat if you want - so bigger miracles have been performed.

Also lower price for retail customers. Days of getting premiums from retail customers are coming to a close. Alternatively offer extra equipment at no charge for retail customers. Either way, make the cars price/value equation dam hard to go past for retail customers.

Finally shake up the network. Sell online or through online brokers. Appoint service only dealers - especially in country locations, to stimulate better standards of service through competition. Hold new appointees to much higher, vigirous and enforcable standards of presentation and customer satisfaction.

Pay all dealers reasonable compensation to fix warranty repairs. Give them a reason to give a about doing the job right.

Pay out whinging old dealers, who whine about changes and support those who recognise that Chrysler went out of the Australian market three decades ago and its time to update the business model and thinking from the big three, to holy **** we are in a twenty something brand market now and people don't give a crap our grand dad who made a mint starting this car selling business.

Breakup monolopies like Kloster Ford et al. They do no good for the Ford brand. You need business that throw their hat in the ring with you - not one who thinks you are just one more brand for the sales machine to sell.

Also get rid of the ego maniacs who think they own their patch and haven't got their sales or their attitude adjusted in thirty years. They are redundant and hold the company back.

In short get fresh blood. Customer focussed, hungry to achieve and totally dependent on mutual success for survival. Treat them well, but have the rules in place to drop them the instant they look like being a liability to the brand.

Reward employees inside company both financially and in status, for consistent improvements in systems, quality and service. Make it more then a "employee of the month" type show and get serious about it. Let the stars and Ford fans in the company shine and reward them accordingly. Give them the responsibility and opportunity to change the business at the most fundamental levels.


Rinse and repeat until bad wood and negative cultural and institutional patterns of behaviour are removed from the company and its supporting infrastructure.

Ford Aust will never rise above its current position in sales and will in all likelyhood, continue to decline unless the culture of the company is changed.

We had glimpes of what could be done with Polites, but that didnt work in all areas of Ford. Now its do or die. Focus in my opinion is not about to turn things around - a short reprieve maybe.

Daniel

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by DanielXR8

I can't for the life of me understand why Ford don't maximise the Falcons potential, irrespective of wether they make a small car.

Fit current technology LPG system to it. Fix the issues with the car. Yes I know its a darn sight better car then BF, but there are still shortcuts and engineering compromises that can be improved on. Raise build quality if at all possible. I won't say fix dealer network, as Ford will fail in Australia, before they will do that apparently. Start replacing it is probably more appropriate.

The FG was gonna have a better LPG system but there were issues with patents so they had to go with the system they had.

The FG is a better car then the B-series and the problems with the FG are much lower then the BA had. Also from what I've seen the FG is put together sooo much better then the B-series.

So they are getting there, but what you have to remember is that these cars are built to a budget. The Falcon is not worldwide car and the R&D costs can not be spread out like they can with a Camry or a Mazda 6 or a Lancer etc..
So for the money that the engineers have here they do a pretty good job and the cars are getting better and will continue to do so. Toyota didn't get to were they were overnight either. The only issue Ford now faces is selling the car, if it doesn't sell then it wont be built anymore.

[Daymoe]

Link works buddy, but DAMN, thats one ugly artists impression!

[Gobes32]

I dare say that its the Chevy Cruze in another thread?

It's a shame that Holden are doing this but it's Ford's fault for not implementing the idea earlier. The Herald Sun link suggests that Focus won't start till 2012! Come on Ford, get your finger out.........

[vztrt]

From the age - http://www.theage.com.au/national/ho...v.html?page=-1

Originally Posted by the age

Holden to build small four-cylinder car


Toby Hagon, Richard Blackburn
December 22, 2008 - 1:17PM

Holden has confirmed it will build a fuel-efficient small four-cylinder car in Australia from 2010 in response to changing buyer tastes.

Taking advantage of the Government's $6 billion car plan, the new four-cylinder small car will be built at Holden's Elizabeth plant in Adelaide alongside the Commodore.

It will be powered by a new four-cylinder engine and optional diesel engine and use 20 per cent less fuel than Holden's current V6-powered Commodore. The new small car could also eventually have a hybrid engine.

The new small car is expected to create more than 1000 jobs when production starts in the third quarter of 2010.

To be based on the Chevrolet Cruze that will be built in at least four other General Motors plants around the world, the new vehicle was announced to Holden staff and their families at a press conference attended by Prime Minister Kevin Rudd and Industry Minister Kim Carr in Adelaide this morning.

The Holden announcement means that each of Australia's three car makers - Toyota, Holden and Ford - will be building a four-cylinder car by 2011. Each will also have either a diesel or hybrid engine.

Following on from the Torana, Gemini and Vectra the new Holden four-cylinder is planned to cement the future of local manufacturing by bolstering sales following a trend away from large cars such as the Holden Commodore and rival Ford Falcon.

Holden chairman and managing director Mark Reuss says the new small car will be powered by either an efficient direct injection petrol engine or a diesel engine.

Reuss says Australians are becoming increasingly aware of environmental concerns, not just the price of fuel.

"People are growing more aware of environmental issues. It's about reducing our dependence on foreign oil and making motoring better for the environment."

"Just as our leading Commodore range will continue to undergo technological development, this new vehicle will cater for growing demand for smaller cars focused on economy.

The new small car could also be exported to parts of Asia and other right-hand drive markets.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd says the Holden small car will make motoring more affordable.

"This new Holden small car is about jobs, the environment and the family budget.

He also says there are substantial environmental benefits as the Government embarks on its carbon reduction plan.

"It will drive your dollar further, it will take carbon out of the atmosphere and drive jobs into the future."

Mr Rudd paid tribute to Holden managing director Mark Reuss, who has been in the job for less than one year but has already brought fundamental change to the way the company works.

"Mark Reuss brought a breath of fresh air to the way in which this company carved out its future in this country. We are 100 per cent committed to having a local car industry."

The total investment for the program is expected to be almost $400 million, an estimated half of which will be provided by Holden.

The Federal Government is providing $149 million of funds backed up by $30 million from the South Australian Government.

The new Holden small car is expected to begin as a sedan and hatchback but could spawn other variants moving forward.

"Further phases of this new small car will create even more jobs [in the future]," says Mr Rudd.

The Holden announcement continues the re-shaping of the Australian car industry along more environmentally-sustainable lines.

Ford Australia will begin building the Focus small car including a fuel-efficient diesel version - in Australia from 2011, while Toyota will introduce a hybrid version of the Camry in 2010.

Holden has also considered a four-cylinder version of the Commodore. The last time Holden had a four-cylinder engine in the Commodore was in the early 1980s and the move turned out to be a sales disaster for the company.

But despite the recent fall in petrol prices, the move is not likely to have the same effect this time, as buyers have been flocking to smaller, more fuel-efficient cars for several years already.

Holden's V6 Commodore remains the most popular car in the Australian market, but its sales are propped up by sales to big business and Government, which have been slower than private customers to switch to smaller cars.

In recent years Toyota's Corolla has narrowed the gap on the Commodore and the Japanese small car outsold it early this year until Holden's new Commodore wagon helped the nameplate re-assert itself.

The Commodore's traditional rival, the Ford Falcon, has suffered from the changing buyer preferences even more, slipping to fifth place in the annual sales race after decades of being either the number one or number two car in the country.

At the moment, Toyota is the only local manufacturer to make a four-cylinder car. But its Camry, which shares underpinnings with the Toyota's Commodore rival, the Aurion V6, has struggled this year, with sales down by 10 per cent.

Despite those concerns, today's news is a welcome boost for the local industry, which has struggled against small imported cars in the past couple of years.

The introduction of a free-trade agreement with Thailand in 2005 has meant a flood of Japanese-designed, Thai-built cars that have made huge dents in the sales of locally-built cars. This year, Thai-built cars have almost outsold locally-built cars for the first time in history.

The announcement is also a shot in the arm for Holden's local operation, which has no doubt come under scrutiny from its troubled US parent General Motors as it tries to bounce back from the brink of bankruptcy.

GM has indicated it may shed non-core brands and vehicle lines as part of a US Government-funded restructure aimed at re-shaping the company to better compete with its Japanese rivals.

Both General Motors and Ford have hinted that they may suspend development of rear-wheel-drive large vehicles, which could potentially cripple their Australian operations.

Holden leads General Motors' rear-wheel-drive development program and exports re-badged Commodores to the United States under the Pontiac brand, while Ford Australia was positioning itself for a similar role in the Ford global empire.

[vztrt]

Hmmmm FWD Torana..oh well they stuffed the Calais and the SS name might go for No.3

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/Ar...rticleID=59840

Originally Posted by the age

Torana name could be revived
Richard Blackburn, drive.com.au, December 22, 2008


Holden's announcement of a new locally made small car could see the revival of the Torana nameplate.

The Torana nameplate could make a return to Australian car showrooms after Holden’s announcement it will build a new small car at its Elizabeth Plant in South Australia.

Holden chairman and managing director Mark Reuss said the new Holden would have a uniquely Australian name, with Torana a possibility.

“As soon as I walked out of the announcement, two people came up to me and said Torana, so I’m not ruling it out. I’m not ruling out anything at this stage,” an emotional Reuss said as he moved through a 4000-strong crowd at Holden's Elizabeth plant earlier this morning.

He said he would like to involve Holden staff in the naming of the new car.

“I’d like to have some sort of internal process to come up with the name,” he said.

But he didn’t rule out involving the wider community in the naming process.

Holden has built five four-cylinder cars in its 60-year history in Australia, the Torana, Gemini, Camira, Commodore and Vectra. But the Torana has the biggest emotional connection with Holden fans thanks to its motorsport history and Bathurst victories (albeit in V8 form) at the hands of Holden icon, the late Peter Brock.

Holden has already hinted it could revive the Torana name when it released a mid-size concept hatchback at the 2004 Sydney motor show.

That car sparked speculation that Holden could be asked to build a premium rear-wheel-drive mid-sized car for its global parent General Motors.

However, Holden may decide it can get better mileage from attaching the name to the small car, which is likely to be a volume seller.

The move would give Holden an emotional edge over its four-cylinder rivals in Australia, with Ford using the global Focus moniker for its new small car, due in 2011, and Toyota using the international Camry nameplate.

The name is likely to be kept a well-guarded secret until closer to the launch in the third quarter of 2010.

The original Torana was released in May 1967 and designed as a cheaper, smaller and more economical alternative to the larger Kingswood of the time.

Sales peaked between 1969 and 1972, when Toranas made up roughly a quarter of Holden sales.

Holden discontinued the car in 1979, replacing it with the Camira.

[Nikked]

i thought that almost a year ago ford siad it would build the focus here from 2010...

lol at torana, SLR 1800?

[jmack]

yeah i heard the media saying they could be diesel,hydrogen and any other fuel to name but they forgot one and that is holden have got that much of it they could run their fleets on it for years ,probably be like most of their announcements full of hot air ,afterall they did have a blimp

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by jmack

yeah i heard the media saying they could be diesel,hydrogen and any other fuel to name but they forgot one and that is holden have got that much of it they could run their fleets on it for years ,probably be like most of their announcements full of hot air ,afterall they did have a blimp

E85 will be the other fuel. Holden are bringing an E85 Commodore to the market in 2010. It is a shame for them that none of the big Fuel companies are interested in selling E85. I know there aren't any companies flogging it near me.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Paxton

E85 will be the other fuel. Holden are bringing an E85 Commodore to the market in 2010. It is a shame for them that none of the big Fuel companies are interested in selling E85. I know there aren't any companies flogging it near me.

United has a couple of pumps in Oz, but very little as you said.
But one good thing is that E85 can run normal fuel.

[XR8putts]

I highly doubt Holden will be ready to start production in the third Qtr of 2010. The articles imply they have yet to begin designing!

Paxton, I was not aware the Kuga will be produced alongside the Focus in 2011, in Australia. Is this a theory (since it shares the same architecture as the focus) or has it been officially anounced? - If you are correct, the Kuga will be an excellent advantage to FMC Australia

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by puts99

I highly doubt Holden will be ready to start production in the third Qtr of 2010. The articles imply they have yet to begin designing!

Very good point, I am thinking that because they are effectively building the same car as the rest of the world (4 other plants are also going to make this car) , the tooling will be generic and maybe the master tooling is already made? If that was the case then Holden will only need to make a new bonnet and new bumpers to make sure the car has a uniquely Australian facade. Therefore it is quite feasible that they will start producing the car in 2010.

[XR8putts]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

Very good point, I am thinking that because they are effectively building the same car as the rest of the world (4 other plants are also going to make this car) , the tooling will be generic and maybe the master tooling is already made? If that was the case then Holden will only need to make a new bonnet and new bumpers to make sure the car has a uniquely Australian facade. Therefore it is quite feasible that they will start producing the car in 2010.

I guess that makes sense, but am still sceptical! Holden/HSV have a history of announcing projects then canceling or delaying them. I believe Ford's Focus target date is realistic and on the money, whereas the Holden date is intended to beat Ford to the punch, with questionable acuracy.

Guess we'll find out soon enough.

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by puts99

I highly doubt Holden will be ready to start production in the third Qtr of 2010. The articles imply they have yet to begin designing!

Paxton, I was not aware the Kuga will be produced alongside the Focus in 2011, in Australia. Is this a theory (since it shares the same architecture as the focus) or has it been officially anounced? - If you are correct, the Kuga will be an excellent advantage to FMC Australia

Not officially announced, but my source inside Ford emailed me a while ago (when Kuga was first released), and mentioned this:

No plans are in play yet. We want Focus to be built to Germany's standards, so we can ask Ford EU and US for more models, to ease the pressure on Ford EU to produce them. So, you could say that we are "head hunting" the Kuga, Focus CC, etc.

Plans have accelerated since then, as exchange rates tumbled. Ford would be stupid to not bring Kuga to Australia. The other stand out of that quote, is him saying that FoA want to build Focus to German standards. This is a huge upgrade from where we currently are.

As for Focus wagon, the only reason we don't have it, is because South Africa don't make it. Ford Australia is going to bring the whole suite of Focus into production.

[Gobes32]

Exactly, they have already announced possible CNG for this car???????? What about refuelling stations, maybe in ten years but not 2011, but thats what Holden does best, they say they are looking into something and that as far as it gets. But Joe Blow is all excited because Holden are going to make his SS run on CNG.............

Just like in 2000 when Holden said they are looking at cylinder de activation on the Gen 3 motors, now they are saying maybe next year????????????? That's 9 years!!!!

[XR8putts]

Not to mention Diesel HSVs, TwinTurbo Alloytec VEs, Monaro 427s, Toranas, Ecomodores (electric), DOD and theres plenty more!

Thats half the reason this anouncement hasn't had the same impact Ford's Focus anouncement had with me. Don't get me wrong, I believe it will happen, just not in that time frame and it will be cheap and tacky in comparison to the all new Focus.

[Gobes32]

And Marin Burela is the man to make sure the different variants make it over here. You could not ask for a better man in charge right now.

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

And Marin Burela is the man to make sure the different variants make it over here. You could not ask for a better man in charge right now.

How is worker morale? During the Gorman years, it was lower than low, however my source states that Osbourne was good at lifting, but having an Australian in charge could not be better.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Paxton

How is worker morale? During the Gorman years, it was lower than low, however my source states that Osbourne was good at lifting, but having an Australian in charge could not be better.

Gorman was good for one thing as Ford, he made alot of people want to take the package. Never had I seen a line worker cry cause he couldn't get the package because so many wanted it!!
Its strange as the old production line use to be a dangerous place.

Originally Posted by Gobes32

China and Korea are very close together to be producing the same car?

In a few US sites Australia was never thought off, I'm assuming the money coming from the government changed GM's mind otherwise they would have stuck to GM's original plan and built it in Korea and imported it to Oz. That was the whole reason why we started getting the Daewoo rubbish in the first place.

[Gobes32]

Down in Geelong he actually used to run the Stamping Plant and he also grew up in Geelong. Also, being of a euro descent and growing up in Geelong, everyone knows him. Respect for him could not be higher and he is regarded as another Geoff Polities.

Morale is steadily going up however we just had a massive round of redundancies so obviously that will take time to pass over. However, it feels like a breath of fresh air has come through the place. Exciting times ahead I hope?

[ebxr8240]

Sheesh they [GMH] like being in the news!!
Like they don't make small cars now??
The head lines don't say hybrid etc..
So the small cars they make in "Asia" now are
not efficient ?? Or small ?? ...
News folks Holden are making a small car..
yes the popes a catholic too ...

[mr smith]

Will it be called the Camira?