XR8 vs SSV including dyno test - Page 2

mtbkym01 · 09-01-2015, 09:51 PM

Wait, what? Was that article talking about real world driving, and not just track stuff? Interesting.

Last paragraph really sums it up
"For the money, both cars deliver outstanding performance and value, but in best tradition of the Australian muscle car, Fords final Falcon XR8 gets the nod."

Let me say, if I could, I would also buy the last V8 Commodore, to park alongside my last V8 Falcon.

SensationFG8 · 09-01-2015, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arronm

I can see holden and HSV both upping the power and possibly both going out on top

It's a shame ford and FPV have fired their shots ,or have they

What about a 400 kW xr8. Ford will know what holden will be bringing. They need to step up

And I mean an always 400. Not just sometimes

The crown for Australia's most powerful family car is far from over

What money is it they are going to use to develop this? Ford have ruled out the 351 tune in xr8 and I doubt they would go beyond that.

I'd say this is it for the v8 falcons aside from sticker packs. The only thing still to come might be that 310 xr6 Imo.

mik · 09-01-2015, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graphicgoose

Well my GT didn't have the Rspec suspension, but my Redline is much more comfortable and well behaved for daily driving than either the stock GT 335 suspension or the Shockworks coilovers.

how do you feel about the steering ? they reckon the commy is a bit lifeless in steering feel compared to the falcon hydraulic steering ?

arronm · 09-01-2015, 10:02 PM

Well I hope your wrong. Plenty of 400rwkw fgs out there. And I am sure ford can tune the car just as well as our local tuners. Maybe ford need to talk to a few

SensationFG8 · 09-01-2015, 10:08 PM

Not that this should need to be said but it's easy to tune a car and walk away. When it's warranted by a large company it needs to conform to more stringent standards.

Alteration to the tune to that extent would require durability testing that as far as I'm aware has already failed (firewall).

Everything is easy to do!

graphicgoose · 09-01-2015, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik

how do you feel about the steering ? they reckon the commy is a bit lifeless in steering feel compared to the falcon hydraulic steering ?

In competition mode it gets a bit weighter. You don't get quiet as much feedback through your hands as you do with the hydraulic steering setups...but you still know what the car's doing and where it's at. The lighter steering in normal mode is great for just driving around town, could street with a couple of fingers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by arronm

Well I hope your wrong. Plenty of 400rwkw fgs out there. And I am sure ford can tune the car just as well as our local tuners. Maybe ford need to talk to a few

Given Ford did a bunch of R&D in a 450kw intercooled GT but had issues with the firewall parting ways with the chassis and it got put into the too hard basket as neither Ford nor Pro Drive wanted to spend the extra money it would have cost to sort that issue out to get it past durability testing, i highly doubt they'd up the power in the XR8 Arron.

GTP534 · 09-01-2015, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Australia's last great road car...?

You do realise the other mob haven't played their final card yet don't you.

Better hope they don't strap that SC on the upcoming 6.2l in the SSVR before it all goes belly up.

Wait for the Whincup edition...

Good point there,

I guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens. A Whincup Edition will probably come with a no cost option of a flask of "limp home" fuel.

Until then, at least we can enjoy the outcome of this compare.

GTP534 · 09-01-2015, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graphicgoose

Given Ford did a bunch of R&D in a 450kw intercooled GT but had issues with the firewall parting ways with the chassis and it got put into the too hard basket as neither Ford nor Pro Drive wanted to spend the extra money it would have cost to sort that issue out to get it past durability testing, i highly doubt they'd up the power in the XR8 Arron.

From memory the issue was who would pay for the crash testing, (Ford or Prodrive) not that durability was in the "too hard" basket.

SensationFG8 · 09-01-2015, 10:17 PM

Yep and pretty sure the reason fgx is still using fg is because they wanted to avoid crash testing. Could be wrong though.

BENT_8 · 09-01-2015, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

We shall see, I know of no 4 door v8 ford are bringing to Australia. Things could change though.

More accurately things Holden do post 2016 are not competing with falcon.

HDT never raced a V8 in '71 but the XY GTHO is still regarded as Australia's greatest production racer for winning Bathurst.
Using your guidelines, the XY had no locally built V8 competition in that race so shouldn't be considered, but you don't hear Holden fans wheeling that excuse out.
The last time Holden took on Ford at the track in production V8 racing was in 69 and the Holden won so the HT should be Australia's greatest V8 production car racer.

To draw a long bow, the end of manufacturing could be compared to the end of series production racing, Ford wont get a chance to reply to Holden just like HDT didn't get to reply to the XY GTHO, even though they did, albeit in a rain affected race, and won.
Hell, even the Torana's win in '72 under the last year of series production rules isn't considered valid by Ford fans because the track was wet.
As though water on the track is somehow alien and race cars with experienced drivers shouldn't have to cope with it.

See this is what makes many blue oval supporters look like sore losers.
All through history they have used loop holes to stake their claims.
The track was wet
The rules changed

Until the GTS was released the holy grail of Australian performance motoring was a vehicle which lapped faster than anything else around a circuit.
Fast forward 40 years and because the GTS would kick the GTF's **** and the SSVR does kick the XR8's ****, all of a sudden the criteria of what constitutes the best has changed to straight line speed to suit the Ford.

When you start shifting the goal posts to suit your argument you lose all credibility.

**Falcon Coupe** · 09-01-2015, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graphicgoose

Surely the fact that the SS-V Redline has been quicker around 3 different tracks by 3 different drivers can now put this to bed?! As the article states, the Ford has got it sussed in the power and straight line speed departments...but is, comparatively, lacking in handling and day-to-day creature comforts.

Certainly looks as though the SS has the XR8's measure on a short

Quote:

billiard-smooth race track

I'm not so sure the XR8 is lacking in handling when on public roads it's

Quote:

better able to keep it's rubber on the road during corner lumps and bumps giving more confidence and better drive from the apex.

Where as the SS

Quote:

can't drive out of the corner as fast and it's engine is lazy down low

I'm happy to see the XR8 gave them a similar on road experience as it gave Flappist and myself on those same mountain roads.
Pity they couldn't (due to legal red tape) let us do a full lap at the track and see the shortcomings.

mattrobbo26 · 09-01-2015, 10:37 PM

The Holden could be 5 seconds, 10 seconds, however many faster around the track and I wouldn't care. How many people will be track racing their xr8 against a SS? Overtaking and accelerating speed are more practical in a real life scenario. Watching the SS in your rear view mirror leaving the lights is more likely to happen than getting them together on the race track.

SensationFG8 · 09-01-2015, 10:39 PM

We aren't the ones on the Holden forums spewing ford bile at the members bent_8.

You've taken a very small opinion and blown it all out of proportion. What is it the 2017 commodore is competing with? Rather than have your massive rant you could simply say "I disagree the car will be competing with X vehicle".

arronm · 09-01-2015, 10:41 PM

Totally agree Matrobbo. And most of the time all of us are just driving along, not racing. Cars are many things and I like a nice environment for the 1.5 hrs I sit in one each day

Bossxr8 · 09-01-2015, 10:45 PM

So what if the Redline is a little quicker on a track. Probably not even one percent will ever see a track, and the XR8 is quicker in a straight line and better on the road, where they spent pretty much their whole lives.

I'd call it an XR8 win.

Really clutching at straws to hang your hat on lap times. Unless it's nothing but a track car and never see's road duties.

pottery beige · 09-01-2015, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

We aren't the ones on the Holden forums spewing ford bile at the members bent_8.

You've taken a very small opinion and blown it all out of proportion. What is it the 2017 commodore is competing with? Rather than have your massive rant you could simply say "I disagree the car will be competing with X vehicle".

its his e battle in his little world of torment

BENT_8 · 09-01-2015, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

We aren't the ones on the Holden forums spewing ford bile at the members bent_8.

You've taken a very small opinion and blown it all out of proportion. What is it the 2017 commodore is competing with? Rather than have your massive rant you could simply say "I disagree the car will be competing with X vehicle".

Im not spewing bile about anything, im simply pointing out that we can manipulate things to suit an agenda.

Personally I believe the XR8 is a fantastic bit of kit and deserves to be regarded as such, but just because its Fords parting shot doesn't detract from anything Holden does post 2016.

The SSVR will be competing against the Mustang as that's all Ford will have, get used to the idea.

Hate the game, not the player.

mtbkym01 · 09-01-2015, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

So what if the Redline is a little quicker on a track. Probably not even one percent will ever see a track, and the XR8 is quicker in a straight line and better on the road, where they spent pretty much their whole lives.

I'd call it an XR8 win.

Really clutching at straws to hang your hat on lap times. Unless it's nothing but a track car and never see's road duties.

As did they, "Ford's final Falcon XR8 get's the nod"

I'm thinking a few may have read Youlden's comments, and didn't read any further, completely missing the "real world" part of the article

SensationFG8 · 09-01-2015, 10:51 PM

You say hate the game not the player yet you called everyone here losers...

It's fair to think ss competes with mustang but given one is a two door I'm not sure I agree with you.

But if that's the case I look forward to the mustang handing the SS more defeat.

BENT_8 · 09-01-2015, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

You say hate the game not the player yet you called everyone here losers...

I haven't called everyone losers, just those who move the goal posts to suit their agenda.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

But if that's the case I look forward to the mustang handing the SS more defeat.

We'll have to wait and see hey.

mtbkym01 · 09-01-2015, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arronm

Totally agree Matrobbo. And most of the time all of us are just driving along, not racing. Cars are many things and I like a nice environment for the 1.5 hrs I sit in one each day

Yeah coz the XR8 doesn't even have a spot to put the "8 Track cassette's", being so dated and all

BENT_8 · 09-01-2015, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pottery beige

its his e battle in his little world of torment

Lol, a low blow from the bloke who invited me around for beers in my time of need.

SensationFG8 · 09-01-2015, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENT_8

See this is what makes many blue oval supporters look like sore losers.

You are right you simply called "many" losers, I do apologise.

Point still stands, you're the Holden person posting on the ford forum in an overly negative way.

Edit: beers with pottery would be awesome fun, you should do it!

BENT_8 · 09-01-2015, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

Point still stands, you're the Holden person posting on the ford forum in an overly negative way.

Edit: beers with pottery would be awesome fun, you should do it!

No Holden fan boi here no matter what you think, just a realist which is why our opinions will never meet on any level.

And I might now.

CQB-241 · 09-01-2015, 11:10 PM

Just look under the bonnet, realise there is something cool under there and not the back of a TMNT, crank the key old school and hear the supercharger whine rather than a vacuum suck. Enjoy the choice. I intend to. If you don't like it buy the Holden.

Bossxr8 · 09-01-2015, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Im not spewing bile about anything, im simply pointing out that we can manipulate things to suit an agenda.

Personally I believe the XR8 is a fantastic bit of kit and deserves to be regarded as such, but just because its Fords parting shot doesn't detract from anything Holden does post 2016.

The SSVR will be competing against the Mustang as that's all Ford will have, get used to the idea.

Hate the game, not the player.

For what maybe 12 months? It's what they have after that that will count, and it won't be anything with 8 cylinders.

Can you consider a V6 Turbo Insignia anything worth buying?

Ford17 · 09-01-2015, 11:17 PM

Ford for the (obvious) win here.
Not sure how the opposition even stacked up.

skoobysGT · 09-01-2015, 11:17 PM

Got to be the first review that thinks a manual XR8 would be quicker than an auto

SensationFG8 · 09-01-2015, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENT_8

No Holden fan boi here no matter what you think, just a realist which is why our opinions will never meet on any level.

And I might now.

Yet you agreed the 2017 commodore will not compete with falcon only 30mins ago...

You think you're a realist but reality says you're just like everyone else here a person with an opinion. Sadly you reverted to name calling to express it as you were incapable of keeping the discussion on the "game" rather than the "person" as you put it.

BENT_8 · 09-01-2015, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

For what maybe 12 months? It's what they have after that that will count, and it won't be anything with 8 cylinders.

Can you consider a V6 Turbo Insignia anything worth buying?

Nope, wouldn't buy a 4cyl Mustang either.