Very Worrying!!! - Page 2

Falc'man · 25-01-2007, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDAA

On the more positive side, at least we know their will be a 40th anniversary limited edition GT:Reverend:

It better have a motor like yours!

Xitdxr · 25-01-2007, 05:14 PM

Ford/FPV make excellent cars. But there failing is in the V8 range. They dont, and never have done enough for the V8, not even in the tickford days. It is high time they started developing the 8 and get it moving, even if it means buying the american 5.4 supercharged bugger thats fitted to the mustang GT500.

WASP · 25-01-2007, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falc'man

It better have a motor like yours!

lol, not sure about that but it may get chrome side mirrors!

Outbackjack · 25-01-2007, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave_au

We should be seeing mules of the Orion on the road by now. Why havent we?

There are some black mules getting around the Alice at the moment. Haven't seen them long enough to see what they are. But they are black, big and heavily taped up. I will try and get a look when I get some time off.

Tealglow · 25-01-2007, 07:52 PM

I've seen them too, they are left hand drive though

The rear lights look vaguely BA. I haven't been close enough to see what they are, but they look Jaguar to me.

FPV8U · 25-01-2007, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDAA

lol, not sure about that but it may get chrome side mirrors!

LOL, funny thing is your right :togo:

EviLkarL · 25-01-2007, 08:25 PM

[QUOTE]One of the key obstacles to early Tickford and FPV success was a British mindset that placed little value on Ford's unique Australian muscle car heritage. Does the latest Prodrive move signal a return to British staff with this mindset? [QUOTE]

One thing the latest FPV's have that Holden are completely missing in the new series is the cars look good, they look muscle and they sound tuff.

Its all very well saying that the engines have been static since the release of 2002, but its agreat engine.

Allot of what this guy says is true, most is opinion and from a reporter that probably gets plenty of freebies from Holden and thinks that newer, bigger, faster and more expensive is the way to go, his opinion means very little to me.

The BA-BF range of vehicles are true blue aussie supercars and makes te new commodore look like a wannabe. Behind the times, I don't think so, streaks ahead IMHO

Bossxr8 · 27-01-2007, 01:04 PM

I think its just a case of Prodrive battening down the hatches for the next 15 months. They know whats coming, lower sales against the new HSV range, so they will cut costs in preparation for this until Orion arrives. They couldn't keep overheads the same when the sales will eventually drop. Falcon sales are very low, and FPV sales will soon follow suit eventually.

Poetic Justice · 27-01-2007, 02:38 PM

Hm... seems to be so negative when I kinda got the impression that Prodrive are now tired of the situation and are acting to rectify and build FPV back up to kick ***?

Prodrive's experience to me tells me if they think that FPV is lacking, they'll get in there and get the things they need to get FPV back in the game (read: source a decent engine from Ford US regardless if AU are doing it.)

Outbackjack · 27-01-2007, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

There are some black mules getting around the Alice at the moment. Haven't seen them long enough to see what they are. But they are black, big and heavily taped up. I will try and get a look when I get some time off.

I saw them again. Got close enough this time to see japanese writing on the rear of one of the cars. Definately not fords.

Outbackjack · 27-01-2007, 03:23 PM

http://www.news.com.au/business/stor...83-462,00.html

Interseting..... Mr Packer is not in the business of loosing money. Or would he carve and sell, take a quick profit, and run. ??

HSE2 · 27-01-2007, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

I think its just a case of Prodrive battening down the hatches for the next 15 months. They know whats coming, lower sales against the new HSV range, so they will cut costs in preparation for this until Orion arrives. They couldn't keep overheads the same when the sales will eventually drop. Falcon sales are very low, and FPV sales will soon follow suit eventually.

If that were true you would have seen cuts back off the shop floor. Such a reduction has already taken place before BF was launched. That roll back was foreseen some time ago. This one is aimed at the product and the decision making behind it. The interface with Ford remains unchanged.

The concern is that although it might be a smoke screen, a manufacturer wanting better marketing and sales is not what is required, especially when the control of the dealerships is essentially out of the manufactures control. It shows a lack of understanding about what the product is about. FPV has been in cost cutting mode for some time and it has been to the detriment of the product, especially when you get to the stage where basic ford cars have the options that have just dropped from the line up.

Concerns about he FPV direction and decisions have been growing internally at Ford for sometime.

The main reason is the labour cost of producing a hand made V8. This end of the market is always about a V8 and deep down they know this. You can expand it other engine alternatives but the heart and soul is a V8. You only have to look at the repeat business HSV have generated in the last three months to see where FPV have fallen short.

In this end of the market the product essentially sells itself. No restructuring of internal staff will gain a better review by “wheels” of the same product. No increase in sales support will change the perception that a product, the ilk of FPV, shouldn’t be seen as stagnate. The media are commenting on it. Owners are commenting on it, potential consumers are commenting on it.

The dilemma FPV have is cost justification. Anyone in business knows you don’t become competitive by cutting your wage out lay. It’s no long term fix.

In what has always been and most likely always will be a V8 desired market, some hard decisions have to be made. The BOSS engine eats up too much R and D money at the detriment to the overall product and profitability.

The engine factory was in the picture long before prodrive where, so ignorance of the Ford situation is no excuse and or a surprise. Prodrive wouldn’t have incurred the full cost here either.

Brian Mears hasn't struck me with confidence that he knows or understands what it will take to achieve what Ford requires of this product. The current climatic conditions might make that impossible to achieve moving forward, but anytime I hear a brand that is meant to be aspiration and a technical tour deforce, talking about sales and marketing instead of concentrating the focus on the core business, I get nervous. Hopefully its smoke and mirrors and the increased attention is about delivering the same sort of improvement as Prodrive delivered to FPR.

There seems to be a budgetary undertone mixed up in all this. I suspect that no matter how many people loose their livelihoods the people controlling the budget won’t care.

Arguably FPV will need to find about 7 million on top of what Ford have spent on the donor car to remain competitive. After the recent years of stagnate development and unique feature content removal from the premium brand, if it was for any reason other then to build the war chess, there will be considerable backlash from the Ford faithful.

For the V8 fraternity who have been on the receiving end of the red team for so long only to have the "worth" question from within added to the mix, that is unacceptable. FPV should consider them selves on notice.

Bossxr8 · 27-01-2007, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HSE2

If that were true you would have seen cuts back off the shop floor. Such a reduction has already taken place before BF was launched. This roll back was foreseen some time ago. This one is aimed at the product and the decision making behind it. The interface with Ford remains unchanged.

The concern is that although it might be a smoke screen, a manufacturer wanting better marketing and sales is not what is required especially when the control of the dealerships is essentially out of the manufactures control. It shows a lack of understanding about what the product is about. FPV has been in cost cutting mode for some time and it has been to the detriment of the product, especially when you get to the stage where basic ford cars have the options that have just be dropped.

Concerns about he FPV direction and decisions have been growing internally at Ford for sometime.

The main reason is the labour cost of producing a V8. This end of the market is always about a V8 and deep down they know this. You only have to look at the repeat business HSV have generated in the last three months to see where FPV have fallen short.

In this end of the market the product essentially sells itself. No restructuring of internal staff will gain a better review by “wheels” of the same product. No increase in sales support will change the perception that a product of the ilk of FPV shouldn’t be seen as stagnate. The media are commenting on it. Owners are commenting on it, potential consumers are commenting on it.

The dilemma FPV have is cost justification. Anyone in business knows you don’t become competitive by cutting your wage out lay. It’s no long term fix.

In what has always been and most likely always will be a V8 desired market some hard decisions have to be made. The BOSS engine eats up too much R and D money at the detriment to the overall product and profitability.

The engine factory was in the picture long before prodrive where in the picture, so ignorance of the Ford situation is no excuse and or a surprise. Prodrive wouldn’t have incurred the full cost here either.

Brian Mears hasn't struck me with confidence that he knows or understands what it will take to achieve what Ford requires of this product. The current climatic conditions might make that impossible to achieve moving forward, but anytime I hear a brand that is meant to be aspiration and a technical tour deforce, talking about sales and marketing instead of concentrating the focus on the core business, I get nervous. Hopefully its smoke and mirrors and the increased attention is about delivering the same sort of improvement as Prodrive delivered to FPR.

There seems to be a budgetary undertone mixed up in all this. I suspect that no matter how many people lose their livelihoods the people controlling the budget won’t care.

Arguably FPV will need to find about 7 million on top of what Ford have spent on the donor car to remain competitive. After the recent years of stagnate development and unique feature content removal form the premium brand if it was for any reason other then to build the war chess there will be considerable backlash for the Ford faithful.

For the V8 fraternity who have been on the receiving end of the red team for so long to also have the worth question from within, that is unacceptable. FPV should consider them selves on notice.

There would have been cutbacks in the labour area too, just as Ford has done recently. You just wouldn't hear about it, or the numbers would have been included in the number Ford cut loose.

As for the V8 problem, its already too late to change that isn't it. FPV would already have made the product planning decisions and would be currently doing the R&D on whatever engine they have chosen, wether that be crate SC or upgraded Boss. They would be too far into it now. They probaly already have mules running around with the Orion FPV engines.

HSE2 · 27-01-2007, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

There would have been cutbacks in the labour area too, just as Ford has done recently. You just wouldn't hear about it, or the numbers would have been included in the number Ford cut loose.

These redundancies, and they were paid redundancies, isn’t about the next 15 months at all. That issue was well known prior to Saks employment