NBN so far, whats your experience?

[devilcv8]

Originally Posted by Kieron

FTTN is essentially like lots of mini exchanges (nodes) dotted around suburbs, typically you'll find a light green cabinet located next to those phone line distribution poles, I believe the phone tech comes out and taps your copper wire in that pole to the NBN cabinet

Node cabinets are usually near the pillar that feeds an area, however in some cases they are no where near the pillar and results in excessive copper length.

FTTC is fibre from that NBN cabinet, up the street to a pit, then copper from that pit to your house for the last 'hop'.

Close. FTTC fibre does not come from a FTTN cabinet. In fact the only difference in the fibre run between FTTP and FTTC is where the fibre ends at or near the premises

I see FTTN as a much faster/cheaper way to get higher speeds to homes with the ability to progressively move to the ultimate FTTP as smart in Australia given our sp****ness
.

extending fibre from the node to the premises won’t give you the same speeds as FTTP as the nodes only have 2 fibres connecting them back into the network and are speed limited. There are some good network diagrams that show the various FTTx variants.

FTTN is a waste of everyone’s time and money. The only benefit is allowing more premises to be connected quicker, however even that is questionable due to the delay when the libs took over and directed NBN to stop.
We have 10s of thousands of nodes that have batteries that will require replacing every 5 years, active equipment that requires power and can fail resulting in outages and requires the crappy distribution copper network which leaves far too many withsub ADSL2+ speeds.

Off my soapbox now.

[Kieron]

Originally Posted by devilcv8

Node cabinets are usually near the pillar that feeds an area, however in some cases they are no where near the pillar and results in excessive copper length.

I did say typically

Close. FTTC fibre does not come from a FTTN cabinet. In fact the only difference in the fibre run between FTTP and FTTC is where the fibre ends at or near the premises

If FFTC doesn't come from the cabinet, where dos it come from?

I think I did state the difference between FTTN and FTTC endpoints correctly.

extending fibre from the node to the premises won’t give you the same speeds as FTTP as the nodes only have 2 fibres connecting them back into the network and are speed limited. There are some good network diagrams that show the various FTTx variants.

I think your referring to the actual optical distribution network here. At some point, a network has to congregate to a shared cabling resource. An NBN cabinet may have two fibers entering but its the devices at either end that determines the speed. Cabinets in turn congregate back to another central point and so on.

Sure, those cabinet cables have a limited shared speed but as new tech comes along, the endpoint devices can been upgraded as required regardless of where they are physically located.

What was the original FTTP network topology -

Devices in phone exchanges and individual fibres to each home?

Devices in exchanges and backbone fibre cables up streets with taps to each home?

Mini exchanges around suburbs with fibre to each home or backbone up streets with taps to homes?

Mini exchanges around suburbs with fibre cables up streets with taps to each home?

FTTN is a waste of everyone’s time and money. The only benefit is allowing more premises to be connected quicker, however even that is questionable due to the delay when the libs took over and directed NBN to stop.
We have 10s of thousands of nodes that have batteries that will require replacing every 5 years, active equipment that requires power and can fail resulting in outages and requires the crappy distribution copper network which leaves far too many withsub ADSL2+ speeds.

Off my soapbox now.

My guess is most of Australia would still be waiting for NBN if it remained 100% FTTP, stunting the growth of internet in Australia, FTTN is fast enough and is still expandable.

I would have thought the exchanges housing the networking equipment for FTTN would require power backup equipment and associated maintenance?

[devilcv8]

Originally Posted by Kieron

If FFTC doesn't come from the cabinet, where dos it come from?

I think I did state the difference between FTTN and FTTC endpoints correctly.

fibre up until the FTTC unit is distributed exactly the same as FTTP, aka from the nearest GPON. If you pay for a fibre upgrade from FTTC to FTTP the fibre run is from the FTTC unit to your premises. To do the same for a FTTN premises means running fibre from the nearest GPON which is a long way upstream from the node, hence will cost a lot more.

I think your referring to the actual optical distribution network here. At some point, a network has to congregate to a shared cabling resource. An NBN cabinet may have two fibers entering but its the devices at either end that determines the speed. Cabinets in turn congregate back to another central point and so on.

Sure, those cabinet cables have a limited shared speed but as new tech comes along, the endpoint devices can been upgraded as required regardless of where they are physically located.

What was the original FTTP network topology -

Devices in phone exchanges and individual fibres to each home?

Devices in exchanges and backbone fibre cables up streets with taps to each home?

Mini exchanges around suburbs with fibre to each home or backbone up streets with taps to homes?

Mini exchanges around suburbs with fibre cables up streets with taps to each home?




My guess is most of Australia would still be waiting for NBN if it remained 100% FTTP, stunting the growth of internet in Australia, FTTN is fast enough and is still expandable.

I would have thought the exchanges housing the networking equipment for FTTN would require power backup equipment and associated maintenance?

The network diagrams show the various FTTx variants. I’ll go search for one soon.
The original FTTP topology utilises a GPON network and while there are NBN cabinets, they are white and have no power requirements. They are purely for last mile patching to the premises.

FTTN is not expandable to provide the same speeds as what a FTTP solution can achieve. FTTN customers are still hamstrung by the copper from the node to the house.

[b0son]

Originally Posted by EgoFG

FTTNode - this is interesting. your average Australian is 500metres from a Node, and testing shows over 90mbps is realistic on new copper - so close to the best you can get from NBN FTTP that it does not matter. BUT ....
1) If the copper is old/repaired (etc) that you will not get this speed - it is impossible to tell for sure, but if you get 24Mbps from ADSL, then you *should* get 90+ from FTTN NBN - with a likely linear relationship if you get less than 24 on ADSL

Not necessarily... I was on a tophat just down the street for ADSL2. I was shifted to a node 1.3km away when NBN was rolled out, despite a micronode in the adjacent distribution area (over the street) being only 200m away. IMO, if they were going to persist with copper, the micronode approach was more appropriate as it meant you minimised copper length and therefore minimised the inherent problems caused by copper.

As for the condition of the copper, when NBN was first planned, the ALP commissioned a study of the copper network to determine if it could be used. The study found what many of us already know - Telstra had allowed the network to fall into a pitiful state of repair. When LNP took over, they simply dismissed the report because it came from ALP and forged ahead.

Fundamentally, my gripe is that LNP have saved 20% of the cost but delivered a 50% poorer product. We'd have been better off continuing with FTTP. By not factoring in the condition of the copper, they've effectively not budgeted for the ongoing cost to keep it running...… I'll be surprised if in 10 years time, it doesn't end up costing as much as the original FTTP NBN anyway.

[MITCHAY]

This should have been a good infrastructure project and it has been massively ****ed up. We shouldn't be having these discussions about NBN, it should be about how good it is!

I'm on TPG ADSL2+ and with the exchange down the road getting a solid 11/12mbps at the moment which serves me fine with streaming.

I expect I will be close to a node too when it comes so in theory I should be at least as good but I have heard far more negative stories about NBN than positive so I will wait to the last minute to jump to NBN because there really isn't much incentive to jump earlier and possibly have worse speeds than now.

[Sabantien]

NBN came to Winton a few months ago now.

NBN announced a while back we'd get fibre to the curb because it's quicker, cheaper and faster. But when it came time to roll it out they went with FTTN instead, because apparently it was all marketing crap. 90% of the places they said would get FTTC didn't, unless it was a liberal electorate.

I asked the NBN people why it was changed and they said they choose the fastest, most cost effective roll out for the area. When I pointed out their own literature said FTTC was the fastest, most cost effective roll out for the area they replied by saying that they choose the fastest, most cost effective roll out for the area.

So yeah. My initial impression of NBN was they're a bunch of bastards.

Anyhow, time came to get connected and the Telstra tech came out. He had a bit of work to do because at some time previous to me moving in someone had physically severed the phone line. But he dodgied up a connection and used some electrical tape to connect it. He said he'd come back to install a proper box over it but never did.

He was able to test the line and tell me what my max speed would be, and we're on about 50. Not ideal, but it does the job.

It's been pretty stable for the most part. The odd drop out. I went with Aussie Broadband and it's been good service. No lock in contracts either, so I can always change my plan at any time.

Just last night I had my amazon prime buffering something fierce, but right now unsure if it was a problem with amazon, a problem with the nbn, or a problem with my router being in the spare room with no aircon and the temps reaching 40+ every day.

[Nanoraptor]

Used to have ADSL2+ here, and had a solid 21/1Mbps. Switched to NBN as soon as it came here, and for the first six months paid for 100/50 and received a nice 70/35 tops via an FTTN connection.

Then suddenly early December last year I dropped out for a day and it came back to 35/15. Still better than the old ADSL but hardly any kind of groundbreaking. I dropped down to paying for a 50/20 plan and it's doing the job. for now.

For most of my work it's enough. The connection does seem a touch more fragile than the old ADSL2+ which would drop out every couple of months for a few minutes, as opposed to once a week now for the same amount of time. Neither a big inconvenience.

It irks me that the rubbish copper network is being used as if it's some kind of great cost saving when it forced such a change to the design of the network and essentially just kept us off fibre.

[Syndrome]

No problems with our NBN connection. Been more than 1 year since NBN was connected.

[devilcv8]

While I have FTTN I’m fortunate in that I’m one of a maximum 117 properties on the node and am close enough to get 100/40 although the copper isn’t the best as I’ve noticed my maximum attainable rate has dropped from what was being reported when I connected over 2 years ago. Stats below
DSL Type
VDSL2
DSL Mode
Fast
Maximum Line rate
37.7 Mbps 95.87 Mbps
Line Rate
20 Mbps 54.99 Mbps
Data Transferred
2454.82 MBytes 3649.47 MBytes
Output Power
7.2 dBm 11.6 dBm
Line Attenuation
5.6, 25.3, 38.3 dB 14.2, 32.2, 47.7 dB
Noise Margin
17.8 dB 19.1 dB

[devilcv8]

Found it.

https://telsoc.org/ajtde/2014-03-v2-n1/a26

A good article and a diagram that shows the various technologies although they refer to FTTdp which is the original name for FTtC

[danzvtil]

Had it connected Monday, it’s pretty good, 2 devices using YouTube with no buffering and with crystal clear picture.

[stefcio007]

Originally Posted by danzvtil

Had it connected Monday, it’s pretty good, 2 devices using YouTube with no buffering and with crystal clear picture.

Is this 4K videos?

[Mechan1k]

I just used speedtest.net ... and link to my carrier's server (not any other carrier).

My modem advises sync speed as well ... it's only the basic SAGEMCOM that comes with it.

I rang up the other day and set it up ... apparently needs a new MODEM ... it gets sent out next week. Even though i am FTTN here and still use my existing copper.

I'm only going to the 50Mbps service for now. works out cheaper than ADSL2 as well ... go figure. But I do have a staff discount (which is in use now).

My area is wholesaled through Telstra (even though I am Optus) .... well was Telstra DSL though the area ... depends who owns what now to the Nodes themselves and what the backend capacity really is.

Have been told to expect about 40Mbps during heavy usage periods .... which is still double what I was getting anyway.

[minheim]

I have NBN FTTP with Telstra on a 100/40 plan. I generally get in the mid 90s down and about 38 up. Been very reliable to date (5 months) My previous house was in a Telstra velocity estate and on a 100/5 plan with mid 80s to low 90s down and about 4 up. It was super reliable and also had the advantage of providing FTA and PayTV via the fibre but I was effectively tied to only Telstra as my retailer.

[EgoFG]

Let's have a Speetest wave - for fun ... and because I have never done it before.


http://legacy.speedtest.net/wave/f5d0b98c008f9730#

[Mechan1k]

How do you add a test to it. I have no option to run a test or upload one.

[EgoFG]

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

How do you add a test to it. I have no option to run a test or upload one.

When I am not logged in there is a blue box at the top right of the result set that says "Join This Speed Wave". I would guess that is what you click - (after logging on, if you have an account then your details would be saved)


If I am already logged on, that same box says "Speed wave test again"


Either way, I click it and it throws to the test screen.


btw: I am using a PC based browser (Firefox)

[prydey]

Originally Posted by EgoFG

When I am not logged in there is a blue box at the top right of the result set that says "Join This Speed Wave". I would guess that is what you click - (after logging on, if you have an account then your details would be saved)


If I am already logged on, that same box says "Speed wave test again"


Either way, I click it and it throws to the test screen.


btw: I am using a PC based browser (Firefox)

When I click on that it errors due to flash or something and redirects to 'new speedtest' page. It didn't link the result back, but my result would be right down the bottom anyway.

[EgoFG]

Originally Posted by prydey

When I click on that it errors due to flash or something and redirects to 'new speedtest' page. It didn't link the result back, but my result would be right down the bottom anyway.

Yeah, I just poked around - it seems that speedwave is only for "Flash" users on the "Legacy" page.


One result other than me on there

[FairmontGS]

I'm into week 3 of NBN cable. Was a nightmare migration but that's behind me now and it has cost Telstra big-time in TIO enforceable fines and free gear to me.

Gone from 5 mb on ADSL2 to 50-60 mb but it doesn't feel that fast. I think I'm now getting limited by the performance of the hardware. Laptops are 4th gen i5 and i7.

The modem is a ripper with fail-over 4G kick in within 1 minute. That's a clever idea.

Overall, I'm miles ahead financially.

[baboon]

If you're using Google Chrome, then click on the Not Secure button next to the web addresss, then click on "site settings". Scroll down to Flash and click the drop down box and hit "allow".

Refresh the webpage and the test should work.

Good luck.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by baboon

If you're using Google Chrome, then click on the Not Secure button next to the web addresss, then click on "site settings". Scroll down to Flash and click the drop down box and hit "allow".

Refresh the webpage and the test should work.

Good luck.

I use Edge but the same thing worked for me. Right click to the left of the web address and allow adobe flash, and then it works.

[Trevor 57]

after having a bit of a back read, I will stick by my original observation that the biggest problem is NOT with the NBN its self but the internet providers, they are 2 separate things

People often get them confused

[Maka]

Originally Posted by Big Trev

after having a bit of a back read, I will stick by my original observation that the biggest problem is NOT with the NBN its self but the internet providers, they are 2 separate things

People often get them confused

You are correct, no dispute Trev, but i did also say the word noob in that first post lol.

Now im on my second gateway from Telstra which is still playing up, Telstra have their NBN team looking at the problem again atm but in my opinion just like Russell said its the supplied gateway from Telstra.

Telstra will probably supply another gateway lol & aound we go again..

cheers, Maka

[sgt_doofey]

Originally Posted by Big Trev

after having a bit of a back read, I will stick by my original observation that the biggest problem is NOT with the NBN its self but the internet providers, they are 2 separate things

People often get them confused

Just out of curiosity, why is the problem with the ISP?
I only get 26Mb/s on my 50Mb/s plan. That's all that the stupid copper I've got will allow. It's nothing to do with the ISP, but the crap that's laying in the ground.

We're moving in a couple of weeks to a new rental. Hopefully I get better speeds there.

On a side note, why do people still use Telstra as an ISP? They're customer service is absolute rubbish as is their value for money. I've been with Internode myself and they service for the last 15+ years that I've been with them has been great.

[DK30RB]

Was on ADSL getting about 5Mbps down/ 0.2 up. Was terrible.

Got NBN early in 2017 - FTTN. Node is however in front of my house. Had the tech patch my copper connection directly at the node.

I am on a 100/100 corporate plan. I get a consistent speed of 91Mbps Down/ 91 Mbps up. Very little congestion. We are however in a suburb that is made up of 1 acre blocks so low housing density probably helps.

My modem tells me my Sync speed and its connecting to NBN network at 151Mbps, theoretically if they offer a 150Mbps plan i will sign up.

We can currently stream 3x 4k tv's (Netflix/Foxtel etc) with no lag or loading wait times.

Its sensational.

I run an IT company so its been great for remote access and working from home.

Having said all that, i have seen many NBN horror stories, from bad installs to speeds being slower than ADSL.

[b0son]

Originally Posted by DK30RB

Its sensational.

When the node is right out the front, of course it is.

I'm 1.3km away! Cant wait for 5G

[EgoFG]

I just got a phone call from Optus asking me to replace my old Netgear (Hopeless from a functionality point of view) with a Seagem (Almost as bad, but maybe only 10 year old it its design), the interesting thing she said was that there will be a new netgear next year.


Now there is no Netgear that I would currently use (My Dream is a Draytek - when I get around to it), but anything would be a step up from the first two NBN connection routers that Optus offered

[Tonz]

NBN related but slightly off topic, we are using Aussiebroadband wireless well this pops up every month

Aussie Broadband Pty Ltd ABN 29 132 090 192
PO Box 3351
Gippsland Mail Centre VIC 3841

just curious as to why they would be in Morwell... something to do with high unemployment ? I doubt it.

[hackney]

Has anybody gone over(or are already with) Telstra & has one of their new Frontier 2 modems.What have they been like etc...I am with IPrimus & have a Huawei G659 modem.Both I Primus & the modem have been rock solid in operation,no complaints.I am looking @ swapping over,but not really sure as yet.Cheers