2011 LW Focus Timing Belt or Chain ??

josem · 12-01-2012, 12:36 PM

Does anyone know whether the latest Focus have timing belts or chains ?

sysh · 12-01-2012, 05:00 PM

AFAIK it's timing chains, even the previous LV.

josem · 12-01-2012, 07:10 PM

According to this technical spec of the 1.6 Duratec Ti-VCT Sigma engine, it uses timing belt.

2011 1.6 Duratec Ti-VCT 105/125 hp (Focus MkIII)
Valve gear - DOHC with 4 valves per cylinder, twin independent variable cam timing
Valves per cylinder - 4
Camshaft drive - Timing belt with dynamic tensioner
Crankshaft - Cast iron, 4 counterweights, 5 main bearings
Engine management - Siemens ECM EMS2101 16 Bit
Fuel injection - Electronic port fuel injection
Emission controls - Close coupled three-way catalyst system with heated oxygen sensors and catalyst monitor sensors post catalyst
Emission level - Euro5
Lubrication system - Pressure-fed lubrication system with full flow oil filter
Lubrication system capacity with filter (L) - 4.1
Cooling system - Water pump with thermostat and valves
Cooling system capacity, incl. heater (5.5)

from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Sigma_engine

rand0mn00b · 12-01-2012, 10:43 PM

your manual should mention it. if the service intervals is ~100,000KM then i'd say it's a belt but if it says it's ~200,000 then i'd say it's chain

AG3 · 13-01-2012, 02:47 AM

The 1.8, 2.0, 2.3 and 2.5 Ford engines that use the Mazda MZR block use Timing Chains.
The smaller 1.25, 1.4 and 1.6 Ford engines (Sigma) use Timing belts.

josem · 13-01-2012, 12:34 PM

Thanks for the info AG3. I just ordered the 1.6 Ambiente. My budget did not allow me to go for the 2.0 Trend or Sport. Had I known it was using timing belt, I would have delayed my decision until I have the money for the Trend at least. The extra dollars for the timing belt replacement is considerable unless I can find a good cheap Ford mechanic instead of bringing it to the dealership. Last time I brought my car for a timing belt replacement to the dealer I came out $2500 poorer which could be the difference between the 1.6 Ambiente and the 2.0 Trend.

Nichol · 13-01-2012, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by josem

Thanks for the info AG3. I just ordered the 1.6 Ambiente. My budget did not allow me to go for the 2.0 Trend or Sport. Had I known it was using timing belt, I would have delayed my decision until I have the money for the Trend at least. The extra dollars for the timing belt replacement is considerable unless I can find a good cheap Ford mechanic instead of bringing it to the dealership. Last time I brought my car for a timing belt replacement to the dealer I came out $2500 poorer which could be the difference between the 1.6 Ambiente and the 2.0 Trend.

You should still be able to cancel your order and get your deposit back for the car, if you placed one. The Ambiente is at a great price right now but like you said, the replacement for a timing belt could be the extra money for a Trend. Either way, both models are great and packed with features.

Imolator · 14-01-2012, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by josem

Thanks for the info AG3. I just ordered the 1.6 Ambiente. My budget did not allow me to go for the 2.0 Trend or Sport. Had I known it was using timing belt, I would have delayed my decision until I have the money for the Trend at least. The extra dollars for the timing belt replacement is considerable unless I can find a good cheap Ford mechanic instead of bringing it to the dealership. Last time I brought my car for a timing belt replacement to the dealer I came out $2500 poorer which could be the difference between the 1.6 Ambiente and the 2.0 Trend.

The timing belt in the 1.6l sigma engine has to be changed at 150,000 km or 10 years according to Ford Aus. (listed in my wt Zetec service manual) So unless you are going to keep the car for a long time it shouldn't really matter.

Citwit · 15-01-2012, 01:39 AM

I am beginning to think that Ford put down the first figure they think of as a replacement interval for timing belts as long as its outside the warranty period. After the warranty runs out it doesn't matter what interval they recommend as its not their problem if it breaks.
In the LT service manual they state 240,000 km or 10 years for both the diesel and petrol versions. The petrol has a chain and the diesel has a belt. They are being extremely optimistic claiming 240,000 km for a belt.
Interestingly the Haynes manual for the diesel version (4807) states that the UK Ford interval for the belt on the 2 litre diesels is 125,000 miles (200,000 km) or 10 years - why the difference from the Ford Australia recommendation.
Haynes also recommend that the the interval is reduced to 62,500 miles (100,000 km) particularly on vehicles that are subjected to intensive use i.e. short journeys or a lot of stop-start driving.
I would like to see the data they use to base their service life recommendations for timing belts if such data exists.
My understanding is that a chain is used as it has a much longer service life than a belt. If this is the case I can't see how they can claim the same service life for both. When the same PSA diesel engine is used in a Peugeot or Citroen the recommended belt service life is around 80,000 km.

kevino · 15-01-2012, 09:00 AM

This is a fascinating post.
So the 2.0ltr is based on a Mazda engine and the 1.6 is a dinky di Ford engine.I always thought my previous car a 07 1.6 Fiesta went better than my wifes 2.0lt petrol Focus, the 1.6 just seemed to rev much cleaner and smoother.
My TDCO Focus is up to 77000, quite alarmed to see that maybe the timing belt should be replaced at 80,000 because it is a Peugeot-Ford engine.

Looking forward to reading more posts.

Imolator · 15-01-2012, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kevino

This is a fascinating post.
So the 2.0ltr is based on a Mazda engine and the 1.6 is a dinky di Ford engine.I always thought my previous car a 07 1.6 Fiesta went better than my wifes 2.0lt petrol Focus, the 1.6 just seemed to rev much cleaner and smoother.

Looking forward to reading more posts.

The 1.6l Sigma engine was designed by Ford with help from Yamaha. I agree I think that the 1.6 goes better than the 2.0 in the Focus, and has more character as well.

josem · 17-01-2012, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imolator

The timing belt in the 1.6l sigma engine has to be changed at 150,000 km or 10 years according to Ford Aus. (listed in my wt Zetec service manual) So unless you are going to keep the car for a long time it shouldn't really matter.

It's funny because I cannot find the timing belt replacement schedule in my service manual. The services are divided into A (minor), B (major) and C (extra major) schedules but the detailed work described does not mention timing belt in any of them.

Imolator · 17-01-2012, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by josem

It's funny because I cannot find the timing belt replacement schedule in my service manual. The services are divided into A (minor), B (major) and C (extra major) schedules but the detailed work described does not mention timing belt in any of them.

In my WT service manual it lists the timing belt service interval on a page just after the item breakdowns for A , B, and C services. Its called "Additional Scheduled Manitenance Items"

It was the same for my previous LT Focus as well. Not very intuitive, but it seems to be fords way of doing it.

josem · 17-01-2012, 12:06 PM

Found it !! Thanks Imolator for the heads up. It's 160,000 kms or 8 years. If I am going to keep the car for that long, the expense is worth it.

Citwit · 19-01-2012, 01:58 AM

Interestingly another different timing belt service life from Ford.
I am intrigued by josem's experience of a $2500 cost in replacing a timing belt. I quizzed the local Ford dealer for a quote on changing the belt on an LT diesel and the best answer I could get was $800- 1200 including parts. The cost of parts - belt, idler pulley and tensioner was $430 - belt 215 and idler plus tensioner also 215. This leaves a lot of labour to get anywhere near $1200. Having changed a number of belts on different engines and not being a trained professional with all the right tools the longest one has ever taken is about 4 hours. A trained professional with all the right gear should do it in about half that. In that case the $800 would be a ball park figure.
If Ford is recommending 240,000 km interval can we assume that the idler and tensioner should last that long. If we are chosing to replace the belt after 100,000 km then the tensioner and idler should not need replacing at that time further reducing the cost by another $200.
It is worthwhile shopping around when getting the belt changed. When I my wifes car need the belt changing (not a focus but still a PSA engine) I had quotes ranging from $300 to $800 (plus "dunno we've never done one of those before" from one dealer). Needless to say I took the $300 which was from a non dealer specialist in that make of vehicle. Hardly worth trying to do it yourself at that price.

pugdriver · 20-01-2012, 12:35 AM

PSA diesel engines - on the Peugeot diesels the timing belt interval is 9 years or 180,000 km - much more than the petrol models. I have a Pug diesel, it is a great motor. So Ford saying 10 yrs / 240,000 km isn't such a stretch.

josem · 20-01-2012, 08:56 AM

My wife used to drive a 2004 Astra. The manual suggests timing belt replacement at 90k but because of a raft of early timing belt failures, holden changed the schedule to 60k. Some even suggested changing it at 40k to be safe and not risk the dire consequences.

lowriding · 22-01-2012, 01:53 PM

often belt changes involve water pump and other replacements at the same time ..combined as a major service $2.5k is not uncommon at all. Chains FTW.